2025 - Melcolm Turnbull
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Introduction and Award Presentation Eric Howard Leadership through the Australian Republican Movement as the Member for Wentworth and Leader of the Opposition, and his government contributions as Australia's 29th Prime Minister and other ministerial roles. They are consistently promoting debate and advocating beneficial change for the Australian community, including the same-sex marriage plebiscite, the Snowy Hydro 2.0 major renewable energy facility, legislation to counter foreign interference in Australian elections, and convincing Asia-Pacific partners to continue the Pacific trade group when the US withdrew in 2017. We honor him for promoting the importance of liberal democracy here and internationally by continuing to write and speak out candidly about the importance of a rules-based international order for our security and economy. He highlights the comparative strengths of Australia's remarkable democratic way of life based on mutual respect, the rule of law, and the "fair go"—encouraging achievement but lending a hand to those who fall behind. He reminds all Australians to preserve our commitment to our free and democratic way of life by more fully understanding it and working to strengthen it through their individual daily actions. I give you Malcolm Turnbull, our 2025 Eureka Democracy Award winner.
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The Strength of Australia’s Electoral System
Malcolm Turnbull AC
Malcolm Turnbull AC
Well, thank you very much, Eric. And Mary, thank you again so much for that wonderful speech; you're far too kind. People are saying so many warm, generous things about me at the moment, it must be because I'm no longer in politics! It's very touching. There are even some nice young people on the train we caught here. And thank you, Ambassador, your speech was as eloquent as we would expect from an Irish ambassador. When you talked about the Republican movement, of course, my predecessor as chairman was a great Irish-Australian, Thomas Keneally, and Tom always used to joke that he was the leader of the
movement.
But look, this is such a great cause that we're all here assembled to honor: that of Eureka, the Eureka Stockade, this stand for democracy and for human dignity. As Mark Twain observed and quoted in that excellent video, the battle was lost, but the war that the diggers were fighting for was won because democracy was achieved. Australia became one of the leaders in parliamentary democracy in the world. We are the first country in the world where women had the right to vote and stand for parliament. New Zealand was the first where they had the right to vote, but here they had the right to both vote and stand for
parliament.
We have compulsory voting, and we've had that for over 100 years. There's no one alive who can take credit for that. We've had preferential voting for over 100 years. We have an independent Electoral Commission. All of those things ensure that our democracy is so much more centered; the electoral system works against the polarisation that angry, divisive, cynical people in public life, in business, and particularly in the media, are endeavoring to use to divide people.
If you look at the way politics is operating now in the United States—and I'll come to this in a bit more detail in a minute because that represents a huge threat to us here in Australia—you can see that much of their problem is due to a very different electoral
system. They do not believe that people have a natural right to vote; voter suppression is part of the political game, trying to change the laws to make it hard for people to vote. In our system, which is innate in us as Australians and something we should be proud of, the idea that you would do anything to prevent somebody from voting is complete anathema. We believe that not only should everyone vote, but we fine you if you don't. Naturally, if you're going to make it compulsory to vote and fine people if they don't, you've got to make it easy to vote.
The Australian Electoral Commission estimates that about 97.5% of all Australians who are entitled to be on the electoral roll—that is, Australian citizens over the age of 18—are actually on it. Any young people here will know you find yourself put on it pretty much automatically, and they will track you down and demand to know why you haven't voted if you miss an election. What that means is that in political debates and discourse, you do not have to run off to extremes to get the vote out. In many countries, politicians try to galvanise the electorate by running off with divisive issues to make people angry and get them out to vote, but everyone is going to vote here, so there's no point doing that.
Moderation and the "Teal" Independents
Malcolm Turnbull
One of the problems in my party—I'm still a member of the Liberal Party, waiting to be expelled at any moment. Everyone tells me I should resign, but I say, no, let them expel me. You can see the catastrophic state of affairs in the Liberal Party at the moment is because they have been running off to the right. This is always a challenge, but it got worse and worse after I was defenestrated. They are doing that to win the approval of that right-wing media entertainment ecosystem, best represented by Sky News, right-wing shock jocks, and Murdoch tabloids. That is a diminished group of angry people.
While that strategy might work in the United States to get people off the couch and out to vote, people have to vote here. As a result, it has been electorally catastrophic, and that's why Albanese has 94 seats in the House of Representatives. The other great thing we have is preferential voting, which means that if a party does move too far one way or another, there is the opportunity for an independent to come through the center. You have seen the so-called Teals—Monique Ryan here in Victoria, and others in New South Wales and Western Australia—who have been able to come through the center simply because the Liberal Party
moved too far to the right in those seats. Has the Liberal Party learned a lesson from that?
Not yet. At some point, the penny will drop, or a new party will emerge, but our system brings politics to the center, as opposed to polarising it like in the United States. We have a much healthier democracy than either the United States or the United Kingdom.
The Future of the Australian Republic
Malcolm Turnbull
I won't speak about Irish democracy; I'll leave the ambassador to speak about that, although we were were very inspired by it in the Republican movement. One of the big issues on which the 1999 referendum foundered was how to choose the president in an Australian republic. Because nobody wanted a president who had executive powers as head of government, there were really two options: a president elected directly by the people, which is the system in Ireland, or chosen by parliament in a bipartisan way, which is how most countries with a non-monarchist head of state do it. The direct electionists ultimately blew the show up and failed to recognise that you shouldn't let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
Will we ever become a republic? Yes, I believe we will be; I am optimistic. My advice in '99 will end up being proved right for a long time. The way to do it next time is to have a preliminary advisory national vote on how you choose the president. We should thrash out whether it is parliamentary appointment or direct election, and whatever the decision is, incorporate that into the amendments that become part of the formal constitutional referendum process. Paul Keating, another Australian of Irish heritage, used to tell me to be careful about direct elections because once people realise a supposedly non-partisan
president will be directly elected and thus likely political, they won't be as enthusiastic.
I'm disappointed that Albanese has taken it off the agenda; he's obviously still a bit shattered by the loss of the Voice referendum. But when it comes back, I think we will get it done. It's a little bit like same-sex marriage: it was hugely divisive at the time, but when 63% of the population voted yes, the issue was over. If you could say to someone with deeply felt views against it, "I respect your views, but you lost the vote," they just have to respect that.
Global Threats: The United States and Rising Authoritarianism
Malcolm Turnbull
Let me talk about democracy generally and the threats to it. I think Australian democracy is more resilient than the most athletic potoroo you could ever find, but we face a real challenge globally of rising populist authoritarianism. The biggest and most troubling example is the United States. We have to be very clear-eyed about this: we no longer share democratic values with the United States government under Donald Trump. The international institutions set up after the Second World War were based upon the proposition that might was not right, respecting the sovereignty of all nations. Donald Trump does not even pretend to have those values; he believes might is right, and his "America First" agenda is designed to use America's economic and military power to get the best deal at the expense of other countries, friend or foe.
You can say factually that Trump's values are closer to those of Vladimir Putin than they are to any of his predecessors in modern times. He has said Canada shouldn't exist as an independent country and should become the 51st state, and he imposed harsh economic coercion through tariffs that hurt Canada enormously. This is disturbingly similar to the way Vladimir Putin talks about Ukraine. Furthermore, look at the way the democratic system is operating in the United States: extraordinary attacks on the judiciary, laws tilted by state legislatures to make voting harder, and gerrymandered electorates.
What makes a democracy is exactly what the diggers of Eureka were talking about: the rule of law, fairness, and the fact that just because you are the majority does not mean you can persecute the minority.
The AUKUS Deal and the Trans-Pacific Partnership
Malcolm Turnbull
These are risks we face, and we have made some pretty serious mistakes in Australia recently. I have been critical of the AUKUS deal with the United States. It is a mistake that is in some respects similar to Brexit.
When the US pulled out of the Trans-Pacific Partnership in 2017, Lucy and I persuaded Shinzo Abe that we should keep going without American leadership. We kept going, and it has been a great success. The European Union is currently working toward a free trade deal with Australia, a process started when I was Prime Minister. But the challenge is standing our ground and being thoroughly sovereign and independent. AUKUS is a mistake like Brexit because it has made us more dependent on the United States right at a time when the United States has become much less dependable.
The Eureka values of independence, sovereignty, dignity, and democracy are more important than ever. We must focus on an independent, sovereign Australia whose longstanding democracy we will continue to cherish and protect. Thank you very much.
Audience Q&A
Eric Howard
Malcolm indicated he's quite prepared for questions, so I'd ask each of you to let us know what they are. Mary Howard.
Mary Howard
Thanks, everyone. I went home thinking of Sir Humphrey: "Very courageous, Minister."
Would you like to comment on that? To me, it seems that courage is sadly missing right across the board in our politics at the moment.
Malcolm Turnbull
It's easy to criticise people who are in the fray, but I resist that. One of the arguments I used regarding marriage equality was provided by a great Irish-Australian friend, Monsignor Tony Doherty. He was conducting a 6 p.m. mass, and George Pell had just been appointed Archbishop of Sydney. As the congregation filed out, an older lady asked, "Father, is it true
the Archbishop said God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve?" Tony replied, "I'm afraid he did say that, yes." She responded, "Very well. Father, could you ask him for me: if God didn't make Adam and Eve, who did?"
Steve (Audience Member)
Wonderful to hear you in action, congratulations. I woke up on the 15th of September 2021 to see a three-way press conference with President Biden referring to your successor as "that fellow down under." I had a feeling my sovereignty had just been pitched. It wasn't necessarily just about hardware; for me, fascinating was France's commitment. I don't remember there being a major discussion in Parliament regarding AUKUS, and I don't just mean acquiring a $368 billion program, but having American bases in Australia. How do we shift that engagement to being helpful?
Malcolm Turnbull
That's a really good point. The idea to acquire nuclear-powered submarines from the United States and the UK was cooked up by Scott Morrison in a very small group. It wasn't debated properly within government, and France was lied to. Morrison's defense for misleading France was essentially that if they had been told the truth, they would have scuttled the
AUKUS deal. It made Australia look thoroughly untrustworthy.
The problem we've got is that we will almost certainly end up with no submarines from the United States, not because they are untrustworthy, but because their legislation mandates that no submarine can be sold to Australia unless the US President certifies the Navy can spare them. At this stage, they are producing about half as many submarines a year as they need for their own Navy.
The Americans are getting $3 billion US in cash from us, and they're getting a big naval base for their submarines in Perth at our expense. The UK is getting the Australians to essentially pay half the cost of their submarine program. As Paul Keating said, there were three leaders announcing that deal, and only one of them was paying for it—and that was our bloke. It gave the Labor Party 24 hours' notice in opposition, and they signed up to avoid being wedged politically. AUKUS is bad for us financially, it's an asymmetric deal, and it's bad for our sovereignty. As the French Foreign Minister said at the time, Australia sacrificed sovereignty for security but will wind up losing both.
Audience Member
I was wondering, getting back to Trump and the midterms next year, I'm hopeful the Democrats will win a majority. How do you think Trump will deal with that? Will he just override things?
Malcolm Turnbull
The Democrats could win control of the House of Representatives, though it's very unlikely they'll get control of the Senate. I think that would produce some balance. Trump will obviously be very angry and rage against it. In his first term, he essentially fluked winning the nomination and the general election; he wasn't prepared and didn't have a team of loyalists. This time around, he was thoroughly prepared. He has total control of the Republican Party, a whole agenda to put into play, and his staff were selected almost entirely on the basis of their absolute loyalty to him. Assuming the Constitution is enforced and he doesn't find a way to run for a third term, I don't think we should assume America is going to resume normal transmission after him. There has been a very big change.
Disclaimer: This transcript was generated utilising AI based on the above video and has been subsequently edited for readability, clarity, and formatting. As such, it may contain minor inaccuracies or adjustments from the original audio track. Please do not use this text for direct or formal quotations; refer directly to the original video above or audio recording for the speaker's exact wording.
movement.
But look, this is such a great cause that we're all here assembled to honor: that of Eureka, the Eureka Stockade, this stand for democracy and for human dignity. As Mark Twain observed and quoted in that excellent video, the battle was lost, but the war that the diggers were fighting for was won because democracy was achieved. Australia became one of the leaders in parliamentary democracy in the world. We are the first country in the world where women had the right to vote and stand for parliament. New Zealand was the first where they had the right to vote, but here they had the right to both vote and stand for
parliament.
We have compulsory voting, and we've had that for over 100 years. There's no one alive who can take credit for that. We've had preferential voting for over 100 years. We have an independent Electoral Commission. All of those things ensure that our democracy is so much more centered; the electoral system works against the polarisation that angry, divisive, cynical people in public life, in business, and particularly in the media, are endeavoring to use to divide people.
If you look at the way politics is operating now in the United States—and I'll come to this in a bit more detail in a minute because that represents a huge threat to us here in Australia—you can see that much of their problem is due to a very different electoral
system. They do not believe that people have a natural right to vote; voter suppression is part of the political game, trying to change the laws to make it hard for people to vote. In our system, which is innate in us as Australians and something we should be proud of, the idea that you would do anything to prevent somebody from voting is complete anathema. We believe that not only should everyone vote, but we fine you if you don't. Naturally, if you're going to make it compulsory to vote and fine people if they don't, you've got to make it easy to vote.
The Australian Electoral Commission estimates that about 97.5% of all Australians who are entitled to be on the electoral roll—that is, Australian citizens over the age of 18—are actually on it. Any young people here will know you find yourself put on it pretty much automatically, and they will track you down and demand to know why you haven't voted if you miss an election. What that means is that in political debates and discourse, you do not have to run off to extremes to get the vote out. In many countries, politicians try to galvanise the electorate by running off with divisive issues to make people angry and get them out to vote, but everyone is going to vote here, so there's no point doing that.
Moderation and the "Teal" Independents
Malcolm Turnbull
One of the problems in my party—I'm still a member of the Liberal Party, waiting to be expelled at any moment. Everyone tells me I should resign, but I say, no, let them expel me. You can see the catastrophic state of affairs in the Liberal Party at the moment is because they have been running off to the right. This is always a challenge, but it got worse and worse after I was defenestrated. They are doing that to win the approval of that right-wing media entertainment ecosystem, best represented by Sky News, right-wing shock jocks, and Murdoch tabloids. That is a diminished group of angry people.
While that strategy might work in the United States to get people off the couch and out to vote, people have to vote here. As a result, it has been electorally catastrophic, and that's why Albanese has 94 seats in the House of Representatives. The other great thing we have is preferential voting, which means that if a party does move too far one way or another, there is the opportunity for an independent to come through the center. You have seen the so-called Teals—Monique Ryan here in Victoria, and others in New South Wales and Western Australia—who have been able to come through the center simply because the Liberal Party
moved too far to the right in those seats. Has the Liberal Party learned a lesson from that?
Not yet. At some point, the penny will drop, or a new party will emerge, but our system brings politics to the center, as opposed to polarising it like in the United States. We have a much healthier democracy than either the United States or the United Kingdom.
The Future of the Australian Republic
Malcolm Turnbull
I won't speak about Irish democracy; I'll leave the ambassador to speak about that, although we were were very inspired by it in the Republican movement. One of the big issues on which the 1999 referendum foundered was how to choose the president in an Australian republic. Because nobody wanted a president who had executive powers as head of government, there were really two options: a president elected directly by the people, which is the system in Ireland, or chosen by parliament in a bipartisan way, which is how most countries with a non-monarchist head of state do it. The direct electionists ultimately blew the show up and failed to recognise that you shouldn't let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
Will we ever become a republic? Yes, I believe we will be; I am optimistic. My advice in '99 will end up being proved right for a long time. The way to do it next time is to have a preliminary advisory national vote on how you choose the president. We should thrash out whether it is parliamentary appointment or direct election, and whatever the decision is, incorporate that into the amendments that become part of the formal constitutional referendum process. Paul Keating, another Australian of Irish heritage, used to tell me to be careful about direct elections because once people realise a supposedly non-partisan
president will be directly elected and thus likely political, they won't be as enthusiastic.
I'm disappointed that Albanese has taken it off the agenda; he's obviously still a bit shattered by the loss of the Voice referendum. But when it comes back, I think we will get it done. It's a little bit like same-sex marriage: it was hugely divisive at the time, but when 63% of the population voted yes, the issue was over. If you could say to someone with deeply felt views against it, "I respect your views, but you lost the vote," they just have to respect that.
Global Threats: The United States and Rising Authoritarianism
Malcolm Turnbull
Let me talk about democracy generally and the threats to it. I think Australian democracy is more resilient than the most athletic potoroo you could ever find, but we face a real challenge globally of rising populist authoritarianism. The biggest and most troubling example is the United States. We have to be very clear-eyed about this: we no longer share democratic values with the United States government under Donald Trump. The international institutions set up after the Second World War were based upon the proposition that might was not right, respecting the sovereignty of all nations. Donald Trump does not even pretend to have those values; he believes might is right, and his "America First" agenda is designed to use America's economic and military power to get the best deal at the expense of other countries, friend or foe.
You can say factually that Trump's values are closer to those of Vladimir Putin than they are to any of his predecessors in modern times. He has said Canada shouldn't exist as an independent country and should become the 51st state, and he imposed harsh economic coercion through tariffs that hurt Canada enormously. This is disturbingly similar to the way Vladimir Putin talks about Ukraine. Furthermore, look at the way the democratic system is operating in the United States: extraordinary attacks on the judiciary, laws tilted by state legislatures to make voting harder, and gerrymandered electorates.
What makes a democracy is exactly what the diggers of Eureka were talking about: the rule of law, fairness, and the fact that just because you are the majority does not mean you can persecute the minority.
The AUKUS Deal and the Trans-Pacific Partnership
Malcolm Turnbull
These are risks we face, and we have made some pretty serious mistakes in Australia recently. I have been critical of the AUKUS deal with the United States. It is a mistake that is in some respects similar to Brexit.
When the US pulled out of the Trans-Pacific Partnership in 2017, Lucy and I persuaded Shinzo Abe that we should keep going without American leadership. We kept going, and it has been a great success. The European Union is currently working toward a free trade deal with Australia, a process started when I was Prime Minister. But the challenge is standing our ground and being thoroughly sovereign and independent. AUKUS is a mistake like Brexit because it has made us more dependent on the United States right at a time when the United States has become much less dependable.
The Eureka values of independence, sovereignty, dignity, and democracy are more important than ever. We must focus on an independent, sovereign Australia whose longstanding democracy we will continue to cherish and protect. Thank you very much.
Audience Q&A
Eric Howard
Malcolm indicated he's quite prepared for questions, so I'd ask each of you to let us know what they are. Mary Howard.
Mary Howard
Thanks, everyone. I went home thinking of Sir Humphrey: "Very courageous, Minister."
Would you like to comment on that? To me, it seems that courage is sadly missing right across the board in our politics at the moment.
Malcolm Turnbull
It's easy to criticise people who are in the fray, but I resist that. One of the arguments I used regarding marriage equality was provided by a great Irish-Australian friend, Monsignor Tony Doherty. He was conducting a 6 p.m. mass, and George Pell had just been appointed Archbishop of Sydney. As the congregation filed out, an older lady asked, "Father, is it true
the Archbishop said God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve?" Tony replied, "I'm afraid he did say that, yes." She responded, "Very well. Father, could you ask him for me: if God didn't make Adam and Eve, who did?"
Steve (Audience Member)
Wonderful to hear you in action, congratulations. I woke up on the 15th of September 2021 to see a three-way press conference with President Biden referring to your successor as "that fellow down under." I had a feeling my sovereignty had just been pitched. It wasn't necessarily just about hardware; for me, fascinating was France's commitment. I don't remember there being a major discussion in Parliament regarding AUKUS, and I don't just mean acquiring a $368 billion program, but having American bases in Australia. How do we shift that engagement to being helpful?
Malcolm Turnbull
That's a really good point. The idea to acquire nuclear-powered submarines from the United States and the UK was cooked up by Scott Morrison in a very small group. It wasn't debated properly within government, and France was lied to. Morrison's defense for misleading France was essentially that if they had been told the truth, they would have scuttled the
AUKUS deal. It made Australia look thoroughly untrustworthy.
The problem we've got is that we will almost certainly end up with no submarines from the United States, not because they are untrustworthy, but because their legislation mandates that no submarine can be sold to Australia unless the US President certifies the Navy can spare them. At this stage, they are producing about half as many submarines a year as they need for their own Navy.
The Americans are getting $3 billion US in cash from us, and they're getting a big naval base for their submarines in Perth at our expense. The UK is getting the Australians to essentially pay half the cost of their submarine program. As Paul Keating said, there were three leaders announcing that deal, and only one of them was paying for it—and that was our bloke. It gave the Labor Party 24 hours' notice in opposition, and they signed up to avoid being wedged politically. AUKUS is bad for us financially, it's an asymmetric deal, and it's bad for our sovereignty. As the French Foreign Minister said at the time, Australia sacrificed sovereignty for security but will wind up losing both.
Audience Member
I was wondering, getting back to Trump and the midterms next year, I'm hopeful the Democrats will win a majority. How do you think Trump will deal with that? Will he just override things?
Malcolm Turnbull
The Democrats could win control of the House of Representatives, though it's very unlikely they'll get control of the Senate. I think that would produce some balance. Trump will obviously be very angry and rage against it. In his first term, he essentially fluked winning the nomination and the general election; he wasn't prepared and didn't have a team of loyalists. This time around, he was thoroughly prepared. He has total control of the Republican Party, a whole agenda to put into play, and his staff were selected almost entirely on the basis of their absolute loyalty to him. Assuming the Constitution is enforced and he doesn't find a way to run for a third term, I don't think we should assume America is going to resume normal transmission after him. There has been a very big change.
Disclaimer: This transcript was generated utilising AI based on the above video and has been subsequently edited for readability, clarity, and formatting. As such, it may contain minor inaccuracies or adjustments from the original audio track. Please do not use this text for direct or formal quotations; refer directly to the original video above or audio recording for the speaker's exact wording.
